Front hub and brake assembly

[paulbell6]

Hi all, does anyone have any close up photos of the front hub assembly please? I am trying to make sense of it all with the spacers and particularly the sheet metal back plate with the 3 lugs on, but it just won't fall into place! if I get it wrong it will of course easily fall out of place!

Thanks as always

Paul

[martin]

Hi Paul, you needed to make a note of where the spacers fit, they set the caster angle. Martin.

[jleyton]

Here are a few pics Paul.

I found that I had to bend one of the back plate lugs to get it on and then bend it back once in place.

Cheers

Julian

Cropped brake backplate.jpgDSCN1483.jpgDSCN1497.jpg

[paulbell6]

Thanks Julian the piccies are a great help! Whats all this castor business, I thought it referred to sugar.
Yes Martin "Needed to" in the past tense is very apt, I took the whole car apart in 1992, and at the time I thought " I'll remember how this lot goes together, it's a doddle". How that thought has begun to plague me! Of course back then, digital photography was a mere twinkle in someone's eye, so I didn't take many photos either.
Seriously though regarding the castor angle, I notice that it should be 2.5 degrees, but where is that measured from, and is it just the size of the spacers that generate the angle. I am assuming that the castor angle is a measurement taken across the front outer edges of the wheel compared to the rear outer edges, ie toe in/out. But is that correct?
Me thinks I need education in the art of Stag front wheel geometry!

Many thanks

[martin]

Hi Paul, you're best bet, is to take the old girl to a geometry specialist, as soon as she's mobile, handling and tyre wear will be "interesting", it won't break the bank, measuring the angle and deciding what spacers to use is beyond most owners. Your referring to tracking, castor is the amount the wheel leans out / in, at the top. Martin.

[flying farmer]

Actually Martin is talking about the camber angle, not castor which is the relation of the contact patch of the tyre to the line taken through the bottom ball joint from the top of the strut. It is castor which gives the steering its self centering ability and isn't ajustable on the Stag (one less thing to worry about)
It isn't easy to see if the camber angle is out though (unless its grossly out), but if you look at the car from dead ahead both front wheels should be equaly vertical. If they both lean to the same side definately get it checked
Neil

[Bandit1200]

Would add my recommendation to have geometry checked by specialist to check not only camber and castor angles but also "toe out on turns" or (toot). This is the increase in toe out angle as the steering is turned. Toot is also a function of steering rack centralness. Not a proper word I know but you get my meaning.
Steve

[paulbell6]

Thanks guys, all very useful advice as usual!

[jakesmig]

Julians pics are good, and the third shows one of the spacers in place. You should have 4 spacers, 2 each side which fit on the upper strut / hub mount. Assuming it was correctly set before you dismantled the suspension, trial and error should get you to near enough the correct angle. If you make an error it may be visible but it may be each spacer is so close in depth to each other that there would be no discernable differance. They would need to be wildly different to make a huge differance.
High negative camber stiffens up the steering requiring more effort to turn in and also doesn't self centre so easilly, requiring the driver to steer in and out of cornere. The car would also tend to wander more with greater negative camber. A spirit level placed top to bottom on the rims will help out, once the measured space at the top is equal both angles will be the same, and presumably correct.
Any alteration front to rear (if you swap back to front spacers) you would upset tracking.

Good luck,
John.

[martin]

Hi Neil, you could well be right, I'm trying to think back 45 years to when I learned this stuff, my head's trying to sort out, castor, camber, tracking and king pin inclination, avoid getting old ! Steve, I think you'll find that TOOT, is a reference to the Ackerman angle, set at design and immovable, assuming the rack is properly installed, and assuming it's a Stag rack at all ! Not a safe bet ! I would still go for a specialist, otherwise an otherwise perfect car could be ruined. Good God Steve, look what you've started. Martin.

[Mike Stevens]

As far as I am aware, there is only 1 spacer each side which is to take up the thickness of the caliper bracket. This is on one of the upper, larger strut fixings with the caliper bracket on the other.

There may be some shims on the lower, smaller fixings. These are used to set the camber angles. If I remember correctly, they were available in 2 different thicknesses, something like 4 and 10 thou? They also very easily fall off on dismantling!

You shouldn't have to bend any lugs to get the brake shield back on. With no hub in place, it can be fitted by putting it across and then back into place. Sorry that's not a very good description, but it does work. Honest. I've just done it!

Cheers,
Mike.