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    Dwindling Triumphs on the road...

    An interesting analysis of Triumph numbers between 1997 and 2012, by one of the stalwarts of the TR Register forum.
    Link:


    Rod

    I hope the link works, if not here is the text of Alecs analysis:

    Yes I know, there are lies, damned lies and statistics.

    So I've done a little number crunching on Triumph cars, the survivors from the past half century or so that are still licenced, the cars on the road. Thanks to Olly Smith, who has made such a splendid job of interpreting DVLA statistics, and whose analyses I have employed. Of course the data isn't foolproof, but logic suggests that errors are likely to be shared pretty much across the board, and that the broad brush comparisons will be reasonable.

    The late 1990s were perhaps the high point of membership for many classic car clubs, so a comparison between 1997 and 15 years on 2012 seems appropriate.

    Other than TRs, remaining pre-Herald Triumphs are few and far between, and the same could be said for all Standards, and I doubt that the number of running cars has changed much in recent years. For everything else, it's another story.

    The unloved Acclaim holds on to the biggest loser slot, with less than 250 cars on the road last year, more than 99% have gone.

    The small monocoque saloons aren't far behind, 86% disappeared in a decade and a half, from the first 1300s to the last Dolomites, down from almost 9000 to little more than 1200.

    The big saloons, Barb and Innsbruck, fared not much better - just over 1000 still rolling last year, a decline in numbers of almost two thirds.

    Heralds of all sorts all but halved, from over 5000 to just above 2600.

    Spitfires haven't done too well either, more than 6000 in '97 but just over 3700 in 2012, 2 in every 5 have gone.

    Small sixes hang on grimly, Vitesses down a quarter at some 1400 remaining, whereas a 10% drop has brought the GT6 numbers down to well under 900.

    Next time some clever clogs comments on lack of support from some of the Triumph fraternity, bear in mind the figures above - that's a lot of potential reduction in membership numbers, however you cut the numbers.

    Which leaves just one omission, given that I'll deal with TRs later . . . . A lot of folks didn't like it then, and don't like it now, but it's a car I've always admired even though I've never owned one. Meet The Great Survivor, come out fighting the Triumph Stag.

    1997 there were just 3800 Stags left on the road. 15 years on, that surviving herd had swelled to 4600, an increase of 20%, an exception to the rule and in contrast to all the losers.

    Often enough I've heard favourable comment about their club from SOC members, and but rarely adverse comment - maybe that has played a part ?

    Cheers

    Alec

    #2
    Very interesting, thanks for posting this.

    Comment


      #3
      Model preferences aside, are we, the current generation of classic car keepers, confident that a new generation is coming up through the ranks?

      I cut my car-mending teeth at my father's side (a trained Vauxhall mechanic and ex garage service foreman). In these days of computer diagnostics, how are the youngsters going to learn the black arts of hands-on car repairing?

      I don't see too many moderns that will be repairable in 40 years time, too many unobtainable ECUs in them.
      Header tanks - you can't beat a bit of bling.

      Comment


        #4
        Hi Wilf,

        I did a poll on here a few weeks ago and I worked out that about 50% of people who voted weren't actually old enough to drive when the last Stag was built. Given the amout of kids that look and say 'wow' when you drive past, I think the Stag's future is bright.

        As for modern's I think you're right, unless a third party comes up with a DIY generic replacement for the electronic bits, but cars are getting so complicated now I can't see that being a great solution either!

        We'd best hold on the classics we've got!

        Dave
        http://www.stagwiki.com | http://parts.stagwiki.com (Under Development)

        Comment


          #5
          Repair of old ECU's and other electronic gizmos is a booming new "cottage" industry in Germany since about 10 years. Several companies now do it and they also upgrade obsolete electronic components to new chips. The key to success is that most stuff comes from single suppliers like Bosch or ATE even if it is branded Audi, Ford etc., so there aren't so many variations as would first appear. Not too cheap of course but still probably less expensive than rechroming a classic bumper!
          The answer isn't 42, it's 1/137

          Comment


            #6
            Drew - I just hope a new generation grows up that is as familiar with CANBUS etc. as we are with Lucas or Smiths smoke-powered electrics.

            Seems to me the biggest stumbling block or area folks have problems with on car repairs I see on a regular basis is auto-electrics, and they are the single area that is changing most, and not for anything simpler.
            Header tanks - you can't beat a bit of bling.

            Comment


              #7
              The other problem with modern cars is the lack of access to the various key components. They are designed with a main dealer in mind with access to vehicle lifts etc.

              With regards to Alec's original post I am shocked at how few are left of some of the Triumph models! More Stags remaining that Spitfires, is amazing given how many Spits were built. As regards the scarcity of the big Saloons, perhaps that 2000TC saloon that is rotting in a neighbours garden is worth saving after all?

              Regards

              Bruce

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Rubce View Post
                perhaps that 2000TC saloon that is rotting in a neighbours garden is worth saving after all?
                If it is a 2000TC rather than a 2000 then definitely, they are very rare! The 2000TC is a facelifted model made from 1975 - 77 and very rare now, they were not made for long and some say that the steel is not as good as earlier models. Saying that though, any 2000 is getting rare and definitely worth saving!

                Brian.
                Drive a Stag every day... it's wonderful!

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Rubce View Post
                  The other problem with modern cars is the lack of access to the various key components. They are designed with a main dealer in mind with access to vehicle lifts etc.
                  Regards
                  Bruce
                  We had a Discovery 3 TD until recently, if the turbo needed replacing, according to the 'book' you had to TAKE THE BODY OFF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

                  Oh how I smiled when they launched the Discovery 4 TD......... it now comes with twin turbos!

                  Cheers
                  Keith

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Gresley View Post
                    If it is a 2000TC rather than a 2000 then definitely, they are very rare! The 2000TC is a facelifted model made from 1975 - 77 and very rare now, they were not made for long and some say that the steel is not as good as earlier models. Saying that though, any 2000 is getting rare and definitely worth saving!

                    Brian.
                    Hi Brian

                    It has a TC badge on it. Having looked at as I walk the dog past their garden I don't think there is a single panel that is not rotten

                    Regards

                    Bruce

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Most of the Spits and TRs are probably in North America. There are still loads up for sale, restored and unrestored at reasonable prices (in Canada anyway)- and the spares can be bought in N America. But the Stag in N America..........well, you know that story
                      Tanya
                      Tanya: Brit in Canada
                      71 Fed Stag, TV8, ZF 4spd auto, EWP and crossed fingers

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Hi Bruce,

                        sounds like a late one then... they do seem to rot a little more

                        I only know of one on the road!

                        Regards
                        Brian
                        Drive a Stag every day... it's wonderful!

                        Comment


                          #13
                          The lack of knowledge and diagnostic skill on modern engines is astounding. I have had main dealers mis reading codes, misinterpreting codes, and smaller garages being incapable of using their £5K snap on code readers. Frankly there isn't a pool of expertise for younger generations to learn from. too often they read a code and assume it points them directly to the fault. One main dealer a few years back told me, its the map sensor, a new one is £230 If we fit one and it doesn't cure it you still have to pay for the sensor! I didn't get them to fix it and needless to say it wasnt the map sensor, it was the vacuum pipe was split. The chances of cars of today surviving as the classic of tomorrow is pretty much zero unless there is a sea change in the skill level of the industry....soon!

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Rubce View Post
                            The other problem with modern cars is the lack of access to the various key components....
                            You mean like having to remove the power steering pump to get at the battery, or the exhaust manifold to get at the starter motor as with the Stag?
                            The answer isn't 42, it's 1/137

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by dasadrew View Post
                              You mean like having to remove the power steering pump to get at the battery, or the exhaust manifold to get at the starter motor as with the Stag?
                              Drew

                              I have removed and refitted the starter with the exhaust manifold left in situ. The power steering pump removal is only 3 setscrews so not exactly difficult.

                              Cheers

                              Bruce

                              Comment

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