Starter keeps on running

[Peter924]

After having solved all my problems with the help of previous posts by others I can't find anything on my present problem.
I had the "click click" problem when starting the engine, so I ordered the relais starter kit from EJ Ward.
After fitting the kit the engine started immediately. But also the starter kept on running even with in the ignition switch in the off position.
I suspected a faulty relais in the starter kit, explained the problem to EJ Ward and they sent me a new one (excellent service !).
But this did not solve the problem.
Again the only way to stop the starter from running was to disconnect the battery or remove the relais of the starter kit from its holder.
Is it possible that the solenoid is sticking ?

[GDPR]

Had this a few times before - it is the switch on the back of the ignition lock - costs about £35.

the terminals inside wear in such a way they won't return correctly when the key is released.

Russ

[Matt]

Check the low current feed to the relay. It should only be live when the ign switch is on the start position. If is live all the time then, as Kryten says its probably the ignition switch that's the problem and a new one is required - you can just change the switch element of the ignition switch, so don't need to change the lock itself.

[Peter924]

I've chequed the low current feed on the relay. It's live when the ignition key is in "on" and "start" position, and dead when switched off.
Next I removed the ignition switch, these tiny grub screws are a......ss, and opened it.
The contacts were slightly corroded, and I found a grease like substance inside the switch. I can't image that should be there, I've never seen it before in a switch.
After cleaning I put the switch together. But still there was 12V on the low current feed of the relay when the key was set to the "on" position.
I think it can't be mended and I have replace it as advised.
Is there a difference between a MkI and MkII switch element ? My car is a 1972 MkI Federal (USA) version.

[GDPR]

Yes there is a difference but mainly with the harness - the mk1 and 2 have different terminations.

The replacement switches have slightly shorter harnesses too so you might just want to solder the new switch to your existing wiring and avoid having to dismantle half of the column to route the wiring...

Russ

[davidf]

I've chequed the low current feed on the relay. It's live when the ignition key is in "on" and "start" position, and dead when switched off.
Next I removed the ignition switch, these tiny grub screws are a......ss, and opened it.
The contacts were slightly corroded, and I found a grease like substance inside the switch. I can't image that should be there, I've never seen it before in a switch.
After cleaning I put the switch together. But still there was 12V on the low current feed of the relay when the key was set to the "on" position.
I think it can't be mended and I have replace it as advised.
Is there a difference between a MkI and MkII switch element ? My car is a 1972 MkI Federal (USA) version.

Make sure you test the switch with the leads off it - that 12 volts could be coming back to the switch from a wrong connection some-where else.

[richardthestag]

is this not faulty wiring at the coil. the 12v boost to the 6v coil for starting comes off the back of the starter solenoid iirc

disconnect the boost wire from the coil - at work at the mo so you will need to double check your wiring diagram but it will be the second feed to the same side of the coil as the ballast resistor.

[Peter924]

Make sure you test the switch with the leads off it - that 12 volts could be coming back to the switch from a wrong connection some-where else.

Thanks.
I've just tested it without the leads on and the switch is OK !
The brown and white/red wire only make contact when the key is in "starter" position and are disconnected in "run/on" position.
There's is a constant 12V on the white/red lead in the connector coming from under the dashboard. I don't think that's right.
I recently changed the distributor and wiring of the ballast resistor. Could that have caused the problem ?

[richardthestag]

I recently changed the distributor and wiring of the ballast resistor. Could that have caused the problem ?

Sounds like 12v going from coil back to solenoid - circuit in reverse.

[Peter924]

I've disconnected the 12V and the boost wire to the ballast resitor but still have 12V on the relay.
The thing that also puzzles me is that the starter stays engaged and the engine keeps on running even when the key is removed from the lock.
With the key removed there of course is no 12V on the relay.
Will continue my search for a solution on thursday.

[GDPR]

Engine keeps running because the white yellow wire is feeding the coil from the starter.

Having re read this it sounds like the relay block might have the wires in the wrong place

[Peter924]

Last few days I've checked a few things.
The contact switch is ok. I've tested it in all positions and always the right connections were made.
The multiplug next to the starter, which also holds the whire/red wire, was cleaned on the inside.
Disconnecting the white/yellow wire from the balast resistor dit not alter the situation.
Today I disconnected the multiplug in the steering column.
When 12v from the brown wire was fed to the white wire, the white/red wire also was live.
This means that somewhere in the circuit of the white wire there is a connection with the white/red wire.
I think that is not right, or am I wrong ?
To be sure the solenoïd was replaced yesterday. I managed that with the starter still mounted under the engine which was'n't a easy job.

[Peter924]

This afternoon the quest for misterious 12V on the white/red starter feed cable continued.
I chequed the inhibitor switch, because wrong connection or malfunctioning of this switch could cause the problem. Besides the white/red wire it also accepts 2 green wires for the reverse lights. But no 12V was fed to the white/red wire.
Next I disconnected all the multiplugs under the dashboard, except the start/ignition plug. And also the multiplug next to the starter which connects the inhibitor switch.
But still I had 12V that shouldn't be there on the white/red wire.
Another attempt : with the ingnition/starter multiplug disconnected there's no 12V detectable on the white/red wire. I fed 12V from the brown wire to the white/red wire and heard a relais clicking on the relais board. That puzzled me because the white/red wire is not connected to any relais.
Is there an electrics wizzard who can solve this mistery or has any suggestions ?

Peter

[Peter924]

Finally solved the problem today.
I noticed a difference in the wiring of a Stag equiped with airconditioner and one without ac. This Federal Stag originally had an ac, but the po who had imported the car to Europe had removed it. It had an extra white/red wire connected to a relay on the component mountingplate. It prevents the ac from running when the engine is started.
Because the po hadn't adapted the wiring properly it fed a 12v current to the starter.
When the starter kit was fitted this small current was able to activate the relay that fed the startersolenoïd.
It's like a magic trick : once you've seen how it's done, there's noting to it.

[flying farmer]

Congratulations on finding the problem, previous owner modifications can be a source of much frustration!

Neil