Can you check the oil in an auto when it's cold?

[Another Peter]

As the title really - workshop manual states that it should be done when the gearbox has warmed up, but can it be done when it's cold?

Came to start my Stag following its hibernation and noticed the red oil puddle on the garage floor towards the middle of the car. I'm reluctant to take it for a spin to warm it up if there isn't enough oil in the gearbox.

[Seaking]

Peter
Which gearbox do you have? My old bw35 leaked aft every where you will soon know if there is too little the gearbox will slip.
A little aft goes a long way on the floor I would take a look at the dipstick cold. Then start her up take for a gentle drive but also take some ATF with you and a small funnel to top up if the gearbox starts slipping.

Cheers Glenn

[Stagsongas]

As the title really - workshop manual states that it should be done when the gearbox has warmed up, but can it be done when it's cold?

Came to start my Stag following its hibernation and noticed the red oil puddle on the garage floor towards the middle of the car. I'm reluctant to take it for a spin to warm it up if there isn't enough oil in the gearbox.

Cup of Tea syndrome - spill some and it looks like you lost the whole cup. Look back at the cup and only 1/2" has gone.

Might be a good idea to run the engine up to temp. and then shift between D and R a couple of times without moving. Leave in P (handbrake it too) and check the dipstick for hot level before moving anywhere. If the level is OK or needs topping up then you can later drive off with confidence.

Regards

Steve

[milothedog]

Just start it up and move the selector through all the positions a couple of times. let it idle for a while and remove the dip stick and wipe it clean then dip the level. if its between the 2 lines your fine. If there is none on the dipstick, top up to the minimum level and check again when hot after having been driven.

It holds well over a gallon if you do an oil change IIRC so you would know if you have lost a significant amount.

Welcome to the world of incontinent BW35's

Ian.

[Another Peter]

Thanks All, just to confirm that it is a BW35.

I'm used to my TR marking it's territory, but up until now the Stag has maintained full control of it's orifices.

[fussydave]

Hi Peter,

I had a similar event with my auto box. Having left the car for 4 weeks, I went to start it up, I always have a habit of looking underneath on the floor for leaks before I start it and it was dry. I started it up (it took a long time cranking before it fired) and reversed out of the garage. When I looked back in the garage there was a small pool of transmision fluid on the floor. It appeared to come from the area of the dipstick/filler (as confirmed by the stain on the exhaust pipe below this point). There did not appear to be any detriment to the gearbox, no slipping, etc., and the level was OK.

When I enquired at our local meet, several people said this was a common thing with this gearbox. It was explained to me that when left for a long time the oil drains to a certain point in the gear box (presumably the torque convertor) and cannot return because of a one way valve. When you start up the oil is pressurised and gets pushed out the filler until it is circulating again around the box. I am not an expert in auto boxes but this is what I was told. I have not experienced it since, having only left the car standing for up to two weeks since.

I was also told that this box is notorious for leaking, but this is the only leak I have noticed.

Cheers, Dave.

[milothedog]

Hi Peter,

I had a similar event with my auto box. Having left the car for 4 weeks, I went to start it up, I always have a habit of looking underneath on the floor for leaks before I start it and it was dry. I started it up (it took a long time cranking before it fired) and reversed out of the garage. When I looked back in the garage there was a small pool of transmision fluid on the floor. It appeared to come from the area of the dipstick/filler (as confirmed by the stain on the exhaust pipe below this point). There did not appear to be any detriment to the gearbox, no slipping, etc., and the level was OK.

When I enquired at our local meet, several people said this was a common thing with this gearbox. It was explained to me that when left for a long time the oil drains to a certain point in the gear box (presumably the torque convertor) and cannot return because of a one way valve. When you start up the oil is pressurised and gets pushed out the filler until it is circulating again around the box. I am not an expert in auto boxes but this is what I was told. I have not experienced it since, having only left the car standing for up to two weeks since.

I was also told that this box is notorious for leaking, but this is the only leak I have noticed.

Cheers, Dave.

It doesn't leak out on start up, it leaks over time when idle. the first time mine did it, it was parked outside my house and I had used it that morning. Tt had been there for about 4 hours.

The fault is the NRV for the torque converter in the valve block which leaks back and allows the oil from the T/C to drain back and raise the level in the gearbox. this then makes it's way up the filler tube and out. Nothing to do with pressurization just too much oil in the box. strange thing is, and as far as I know, it's unique to stags despite the BW35 having a wide application with other makes and models.

Ian.

[robbo]

It doesn't leak out on start up, it leaks over time when idle. the first time mine did it, it was parked outside my house and I had used it that morning. Tt had been there for about 4 hours.

The fault is the NRV for the torque converter in the valve block which leaks back and allows the oil from the T/C to drain back and raise the level in the gearbox. this then makes it's way up the filler tube and out. Nothing to do with pressurization just too much oil in the box. strange thing is, and as far as I know, it's unique to stags despite the BW35 having a wide application with other makes and models.

Ian.

Hi Ian
I have a friend with a Dailmer 250 V8 and his BW35 leaks fluid when its left for any length of time.
Rob.

[DJT]

It doesn't leak out on start up, it leaks over time when idle. the first time mine did it, it was parked outside my house and I had used it that morning. Tt had been there for about 4 hours.

The fault is the NRV for the torque converter in the valve block which leaks back and allows the oil from the T/C to drain back and raise the level in the gearbox. this then makes it's way up the filler tube and out. Nothing to do with pressurization just too much oil in the box. strange thing is, and as far as I know, it's unique to stags despite the BW35 having a wide application with other makes and models.

Ian.

Hi Ian
I have a friend with a Dailmer 250 V8 and his BW35 leaks fluid when its left for any length of time.
Rob.

In the paperwork for my Stag when I bought it was information that the NRV had been changed for just this reason. It never spilt a drop in the 6 years I used it with the BW35 in it. That box now belongs to another Devon member as it was replaced by a ZF....

[milothedog]

Hi Ian
I have a friend with a Dailmer 250 V8 and his BW35 leaks fluid when its left for any length of time.
Rob.

From what I can remember, back in the day, it was fitted in Rovers, BMC makes, and Rootes models who I did my apprenticeship with and can't recall it being an issue.


Ian.

[robbo]

He's complained about it a couple of times and has toyed with the idea of replacing the NRV. I don't have the problem with mine as it's got the BW65 box.
Rob.

[KOY 23]

Also Fords before they changed to their own box in late 60's

[milothedog]

Also Fords before they changed to their own box in late 60's

Showing your age there John, I remember the ford C3 & C4's these and the GM box fitted in the SD1 had a habit of causing the engine to bellow white smoke when the vacuum operated kick valve failed.

Ian.

[Escape]

Back to the difference between cold and hot readings, the manual of our other classic (my dad's '73 450SLC) mentions a different level when checking cold: maximum level when cold is 5mm/0.2inch BELOW min marking for hot. So I would check cold to make sure the level is somewhere close to minimum before driving and top up if necessary. Which is exactly what I'll do when (not if :-) ) I get our Stag running. I looked it up for that exact reason, as it had a small leak according to the PO and has been sitting for several months.

Filip

[Roger M]

Hi, all
Just thought I'd share this from the archive with you. Can't recall where I 'harvested' it from in 2014:

Triumph Technical Service Bulletin

Borg Warner Automatic Transmission Fluid Level Check - Stag

September, 1972

Due to fluid splash and frothing in the dipstick tube on Borg Warner automatic transmission units, it is very often difficult to obtain consistent fluid readings.

As a result of this, a new fluid level checking procedure is recommended as follows:

• Run the vehicle at least five miles or until the transmission unit has reached its normal operating temperature
• Park the vehicle on level ground, apply the handbrake and move the selector lever to 'P' (Park).
• Switch off the engine and within a half a minute check the fluid level with the engine switched off.