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Seeking details of Stags under LD 200 - especially H registered

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    Seeking details of Stags under LD 200 - especially H registered

    Firstly my credentials to support my assurance that you can trust me with your data. Chris Liles - Mem. 427 / Joined April 1980 / Co-ordinating Norfolk Area since August 1980 / an SOC Honorary Vice-President / Gob-on-a-stick at numerous Nationals & generally a thoroughly good egg! I own LD 112, previously YTB 988H now OLD 112H which is presently believed to be the oldest road-going Stag in East Anglia (unless you know differently?).

    Back in 2002 after I bought LD 112 as a basket case, I made myself (with our SOC Registrar's support & blessing) unofficial Registrar for the first 200 Stags built. I have since built up data (thanks also to Dave Jell, ex-SOC Historian) on most of the first 100 and am now focussing more on the latter 100. If you or anyone you encounter has a Stag up to LD 200, please ask them to contact me (if we have not previously communicated). Their data will be rigidly protected by me and the file back-up only shared
    for safety with our SOC Registrar. The benefit to them is that I may already have some interesting build etc details on their car which was previously unknown to them.

    The data fields I am filling are: Commission no. / Reg. no. / Body no. / Engine no. / Build date / Reg. date / Details (e.g. Damson & Saddle Tan auto etc) / Owners name / SOC no. / Contact details / History.

    The History field is the one which invariably holds the most interest. E.g. after researching previous owners of my car, I now have a 1980's video of LD 112 being overtaken by a Centaur - an awesome half-track Land Rover hybrid doing 60 mph. That previous owner of my Stag was a Centaur Design Engineer, seen here driving his Stag in this still from that Centaur promotional video:
    Centaur overtaking Stag YTB 988H 1979 22kb.jpg

    Finally, my recent chat with an H registered Stag owner inferred that there are currently only 7 x H registered Stags taxed & MOT'd on our roads (his & mine account for x 2) but with quite a lot more than that on SORN. I have been unable to confirm this information but it could be true from my database. Howrareismycar.co.uk infers of 1970 Stags (i.e. H & J plated) that x 68 are taxed & x 26 SORNed. With Stags launched in early June 1970 (LD 112 was built 10/6/70) to be H registered, cars had to be registered before 1st August 1970 (when J reg started). Most people wanted a 'new' J plate on their new Stag so delayed registration until after 1/8/70. This under two months window of opportunity is why H reg cars are so rare.

    In summary, I warmly welcome contact via this thread or chris@liles.co.uk from anyone who can extend my knowledge-base on Stags up to LD 200 - especially if they are H registered. Thanks folks. Chris Liles.

    Chris Liles - LD112 + SOC Norfolk Co-ordinator & national Vice President.

    #2
    Hi Chris, please forgive the stupidity of my question... but how do I identify the LD number of my Stag (J reg, from March '71)?

    Many thanks in advance

    John

    Comment


      #3
      No such thing as a stupid question John, it is simply a learning opportunity! Many of us who have been around Stags for years tend to forget such things need to be learned by those newer to our hobby.

      In this case, open your nearside/passenger door & look on the body within the door recess, just below the lock. There you will see a plate on which the box for Commission Number will be stamped your Stag's personal identity - starting with 'LD'.

      Once you have the number, you will probably find this link interesting John: http://www.rimmerbros.co.uk/content-...le-Information

      Enjoy!
      Chris Liles - LD112 + SOC Norfolk Co-ordinator & national Vice President.

      Comment


        #4
        I've got LD 152 Chris, one of the '70 J plates on Sorn. I contacted you a short while back but you only wanted up to LD150 back then. I'll email you what I have but that (sadly) doesn't include much history. White with red interior though so the best combo

        Paul
        Paul - 3 projects, 1 breaker - garage built and housing 2 white Stags. One runs, one doesn't

        Comment


          #5
          You are correct Paul, I started off researching solely H plates, then changed to the first 112 (i.e. up to mine), then was approached re 117 & 122 so stretched to 150. Then LD 200 owner emerged so I have now expanded to that as my limit! Now I warmly welcome your car's details please - I have none at present. As many of the fields (per the list in my original post above) as you can manage will be greatly appreciated (and protected) please Paul.

          Thanks and kind regards, Chris.
          Chris Liles - LD112 + SOC Norfolk Co-ordinator & national Vice President.

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Chris.Liles View Post
            You are correct Paul, I started off researching solely H plates, then changed to the first 112 (i.e. up to mine), then was approached re 117 & 122 so stretched to 150. Then LD 200 owner emerged so I have now expanded to that as my limit! Now I warmly welcome your car's details please - I have none at present. As many of the fields (per the list in my original post above) as you can manage will be greatly appreciated (and protected) please Paul.

            Thanks and kind regards, Chris.
            Hi Chris i have ld 138 on H plate have e-mailed details over to you Trust you received them

            Regards Shaun

            Comment


              #7
              Hi Shaun, sorry, nothing seen in my Inbox and I have just checked through 200 spam messages received today - no luck. Please will you re-send ensuring spelling is chris@liles.co.uk My apologies but you will receive a challenge from my spam filter simply asking you to identify some random characters.

              I am keen to see your information Shaun since I only have basic details from a previous owner of LD138. Thanks, Chris.
              Chris Liles - LD112 + SOC Norfolk Co-ordinator & national Vice President.

              Comment


                #8
                Hi Chris just resent E-mail l . Would be interested in what you already know Thanks Shaun

                Comment


                  #9
                  Email safely received, thanks Shaun. I am working for a client today so will respond with what (little) information I already have on your Stag tomorrow at the latest.

                  It gives me a chance to think through other tips I can offer you on learning more about your H plated rarity.

                  Kind regards, Chris.
                  Chris Liles - LD112 + SOC Norfolk Co-ordinator & national Vice President.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Hiya Chris,
                    You seem to be the guy to ask - Maybe you could help

                    I`ve been looking after a friends Stag - a 1970 MK1 `LD211 O` First Registered 01.08.1970 and have decided to get a Heritage certificate ordered.
                    They ask for different details such as Engine / Chassis Numbers but also Body Nr Commission Nr. I`ve had a look and found the following plates:
                    T216 LD
                    222 LD
                    Which is which?
                    As this is an early model, It would be quite interesting to find out roughly how many Stags there are out there older than this one.
                    Cheers, and greetings from Elmpt ( RAF Bruggen - Germany)
                    Mark.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Mark,

                      T216LD is the Body Number and was fitted after the shell was painted, thus should remain unpainted. 222LD has no, or little, significance.

                      The Commission Number is LD211 O (letter O, not number 0), and should be on a larger plate riveted to the LH B pillar below the lock catch.

                      BMH should have the Body Number, etc. linked to the Commission Number, and it should appear on the Heritage Certificate, along with engine Number, key numbers, etc.
                      Dave
                      1974 Mk2, ZF Auto, 3.45 Diff, Datsun Driveshafts. Stag owner/maintainer since 1989.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Hi Mark, since you are not the actual Stag owner and this is an open Forum, I will avoid giving you any illustrations involving specific cars. However, I believe I can largely answer your questions. Here is my current understanding about Body & Build & Commission plates ...

                        - Body No. = this was the first plate fitted (near LH bonnet hinge) at the Speke factory. At that time bodies were sprayed at the Speke factory, hence the Body No. plates were also painted. This I believe equates to your 222 LD which will have a coat of the original paint on it (probably under subsequent extra coats over the years).


                        - Build No. = this was the plate fitted (near LH bonnet hinge) later on the Production Line at the Canley factory, hence this plate will have been unpainted. This I believe equates to your T 216 LD.

                        - Commission No. = plate fitted inside/back of LH door surround & allocated at some stage on the Production Line at Canley - for yours LD 211 - O (for Overdrive of course).

                        From my records of other Stags, I suspect LD 211 was built around 10/07/1970. If it was first registered in the UK, it may have been held back by the dealer a few days to 01/08/1970 in order to get one of the new 'J' plates which started to be issued on that day. Many people/dealers did that which is why 'H' registrations (like my LD 112) are relatively rare.

                        Purely for interest, my LD 112 was built 10/06/1970 i.e. exactly one month prior to LD 211. So, it seems at that point production was around 100 per month. However, number sequencing seems to have been quite random (e.g. numbered bodies pulled from storage onto production line NOT in number order) so this can only be a guesstimate.

                        How many Stags are still out there older than LD 211 ... well, up to 210 !! Seriously, no-one knows for sure. From my records and responses to my pleas for pre-LD 200 Stag details, if I were forced to guess, I would put a finger up to the wind and say about half of them. However, far less than that are currently roadworthy/taxed though I suspect.

                        I hope that helps you to achieve your important Heritage Certificate, Mark. One thing I would desperately encourage ANY Stag owner reading this, is to do what you are doing. Check & record ALL such numbers on your Stag. If the car is stolen or damaged and DVLA become involved, proving that their documents fully align with the car could be the difference between your car remaining on the road or being scrapped. Trust me, I currently know of one, possibly two Stags which could suffer that fate due to inadequate proof that they are the vehicle to which the DVLA document relates. Ignore my advice at your peril - surely a little time grovelling around with a rag and pad/pencil is a good investment to ensure you keep your beloved Stag?
                        Chris Liles - LD112 + SOC Norfolk Co-ordinator & national Vice President.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Chris.Liles View Post

                          - Body No. = this was the first plate fitted (near LH bonnet hinge) at the Speke factory. At that time bodies were sprayed at the Speke factory, hence the Body No. plates were also painted. This I believe equates to your 222 LD which will have a coat of the original paint on it (probably under subsequent extra coats over the years).


                          - Build No. = this was the plate fitted (near LH bonnet hinge) later on the Production Line at the Canley factory, hence this plate will have been unpainted. This I believe equates to your T 216 LD.
                          Hi Chris,

                          Interesting. This is contrary to the information on P93 of James Taylor’s book. Your explanation makes more sense.

                          The Heritage Cert for my car (and my previous Mk1) shows both numbers as Body Number.

                          Did you ever do anything with all those parts you collected from me a few years back?

                          Dave
                          Dave
                          1974 Mk2, ZF Auto, 3.45 Diff, Datsun Driveshafts. Stag owner/maintainer since 1989.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Thanks Dave and sorry to partly contradict your response. I had not seen your reply before I posted my own.

                            My comments are based on an extensive email interaction with Peter Robinson (Registrar) recently. It reflects our best understanding of the situation re body plates. However, without a Time Machine, we will never know for certain. I am glad you consider my explanation logical, that is what Peter & I felt it to be. If anyone out there knows someone who worked at Triumph in the 70's, we would LOVE to hear/read from them.

                            I tried recently to trace my missing Body No. (plate lost during restoration) via Gaydon (not shown on my Heritage Cert). Sadly, they were quite dismissive by phone, refusing to check their record whilst asserting that it would certainly not be listed. I believe I can request an appointment to visit/view my car's record for myself. However, that is not at the top of my current priorities list. Anyone out there know another way to trace the Body no?

                            Yes, those spares made it back from Devon to Norfolk and I racked-out an entire wall in my Stag-Barn where many of them still sit. All are tabulated into a spreadsheet with shelf locations for rapid access. They have helped numerous local Stag owners to keep their cars on the road over the years.
                            Chris Liles - LD112 + SOC Norfolk Co-ordinator & national Vice President.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              No problem Chris. As you say, we could do with borrowing the Tardis for a while. There is a lot of excellent information in James Taylor’s book, but it isn’t infallible. I’m surprised the Body No isn’t on the cert; mine has them listed as:
                              Body Number. T.23***/23***LD.
                              Sadly Date of Despatch and Dealer are “Not Listed”.

                              Glad to hear the spares are still proving useful.
                              Dave
                              1974 Mk2, ZF Auto, 3.45 Diff, Datsun Driveshafts. Stag owner/maintainer since 1989.

                              Comment

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