That Certain Sound...A Quiz or an Enigma..No not the decoder!

[Ian B]

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arbman101 wrote:

Does fitting tubular manifolds make a difference to this 'sound' then?

Al, it does change the sound, to my ears it makes the exhaust note sound slightlyhigher. the other option is how I have done things; keep the original manifolds but the fit a sports system to these therefore enhancing the original note.



Ian

[Snakey]

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If you want to know more about the different crank configurations etc have a look at this fairly good site.

http://craig.backfire.ca/pages/autos/v8-engines

Stuart

Stuey you the man! Thats what I was looking for..Thank you

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[V Mad]

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Snakey wrote:

The Stag engine has a dual-plane crankshaft.

Interesting...From the Stag DVD I could have sworn the designer said it had a single plane crank to keep down cost........?

Good theories...bring em on.

Kryten..adjudicate please...

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The Stag has a cross-plane crankshaft. This is what gives it, and many American V8 engines the lovely burble type sound. Flat plane V8 engines, as for example used in Ferraris sounds totally different ( which I personally dont like, I think they sound tinny/metallic).

The cross-plane sound is then characterised mainly by the specifics of the exhaust 'system'; port shape/size, pipe bore, length, baffling, link pipe, header/manifold etc. I think the offset between the left-right has a marginal effect, but not much as the pipes are separate, and I have seen/heard a Stag with an equal length system (with tubular headers) and it still has the Stag burble.

[Arbman Al]

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Ian B wrote:

arbman101 wrote:

Does fitting tubular manifolds make a difference to this 'sound' then?

Al, it does change the sound, to my ears it makes the exhaust note sound slightlyhigher. the other option is how I have done things; keep the original manifolds but the fit a sports system to these therefore enhancing the original note.



Ian

Thanks for that Ian. In that case, I probably won't notice any difference at all.

Al.

[stustag]

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brian0443 wrote:

Great website Craig. Am I right in noticing that the Stag's firing order was not listed in his tables, making a very obvious difference with the other V8s. Or is it time I packed up and went to bed?

Brian

Hi Brian

Yes you are correct the Stag firing order is different to all those listed on the website. This will definitely have an effect on the sound of the engine.

If any of you are into MotoGP you will know that they changed from the standard firing order on the straight fours to the big bang firing order (by changing the crank layout)which gave more drivabilty(if thats a word)but also changed the exhaust note quite significantly!

Stuart

[Ian B]

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arbman101 wrote:

Ian B wrote:

arbman101 wrote:

Does fitting tubular manifolds make a difference to this 'sound' then?

Al, it does change the sound, to my ears it makes the exhaust note sound slightlyhigher. the other option is how I have done things; keep the original manifolds but the fit a sports system to these therefore enhancing the original note.



Ian

Thanks for that Ian. In that case, I probably won't notice any difference at all.

Al.

Al, in these days of political correctness only you could say that! if you are talking about theexhaust it must mean work is progressing well; or are you just getting ahead of yourself

Ian

[Arbman Al]

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Just planning ahead Ian.

Hoping to get the engine back end of the week (I think he meant this one:?)

So can bolt my nice shiny tubulars on it. Still undecided whether to wrap them or not.

Any thoughts anyone?

Rgds....Al.

[GDPR]

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A lot easier to wrap them with the engine out, but could be a real pain if your tubes foul the steering shaft, so it's a tough call Al.......

[KOY 23]

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stustag wrote:

Hi Brian

Yes you are correct the Stag firing order is different to all those listed on the website. This will definitely have an effect on the sound of the engine.

Stuart

Stuart.
Remember that Stag cylinder numbering is different from convention used on Craig's website. If you change the Stag's numbering to match you get 21873654. This gives you a firing order of 18736542, which equates to Chevy V8 (4-7 swap). firing order. Some adjacent cylinders are firing in sequence, hence the distinctive noise, coupled with the exhaust design.
John.

[Snakey]

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If you change the Stag's numbering to match you get 21873654. This gives you a firing order of 18736542, which equates to Chevy V8 (4-7 swap). firing order.

Same as the Rover.....

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[Snakey]

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Further investigation threw up this little nugget.....

The Buick 215ci was based very loosely on the BMW 507 V8, but certainly not officially so. When Buick were tasked in 1956 to design an aluminium V8 engine with a capacity between 3 and 3.5 litres they weren't quite sure how to go about it or how durable such an engine would be as they had no experience of working in this metal. They did what car companies still do today and buy the nearest equivalent they can and reverse engineer it. In 1956/7 if you needed to buy an ally V8 around 3.2l you had only one choice and that was the BMW 507. They most certainly didn't copy the design and stick GM on it, but they did use it as a basis for their design with particular regard to the necessary strengths and thicknesses required by ally instead of iron.

You are probably wondering how I know this? Well, my godfather was a production engineer at Rover for most of the sixties and seventies and he told me. He found out in 1969 - GM ended up regretting selling the rights to the 215 and wanted it back. They approached Rover and offered to buy it back but Rover refused as the management realised it's potential. Rover went back to GM and offered to build the V8 for GM. Initial discussions took place and my godfather ended up talking directly to the engine design part of GM/Buick and commented on what a great engine they'd designed considering it was their first ally one and the GM guy told him he couldn't take all the credit becasue they'd pulled apart a BMW V8 while they were designing it to get the basics right. Eventually the deal for Rover to build the V8 for GM fell apart because they couldn't build them cheap enough and politically it was difficult for GM to buy 'foreign-built' engines.

So the RV8 certainly isn't a copy of the 507 V8, but it did play a part in it's birth!

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