Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Getting Stag on the road after 27 years and young driver

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Getting Stag on the road after 27 years and young driver

    Hi All,

    Iím from Milton Keynes and my parents have a 1976 inca yellow Stag which has been off the road in our garage for 28 years.

    Iíve been driving for nearly 3 years and iím 22 so the insurance last time I checked for my own car (Polo MK5) for a Stag was around the £700 mark and feel if I stay driving my own car its value is only dropping every year and feel like its a good time to take the opportunity into looking at having the Stag put back on the road as my next car. Iím really set on the idea of driving the Stag as my run about for many reasons, the style the sound and being something completely different to the norm, every time we would start the Stag it always put a smile on my face even though iíve never driven one.

    There are few things I would like to know about the car before i commit to the idea completely since itís quiet a jump from a modern 1.2 to a classic 3.0 V8.

    Our Stag after about 26 years last January was started up everything ran fine until the starter stopped working in September, there are few parts that would need work doing a new Driver side door, rear driver side wheel arch and thereís a bolt under the front of the car that bloke off years ago which my father mentioned would fail a MOT. The over all bodywork appears fine little rust nothing we can see to really worry over although seeing as its sat for so many years (the rear break need to break free) I would imagine many parts on the Stag would need replacing?

    Being my next car (I would have my dads mini for when weather would get really bad and while its being restored) is the Stag a car good to drive for all use, what is it like to drive is it great car to use?


    Kind Regards

    James

    #2
    Hi James, its a great car but i wouldn't think about it as your daily driver. First reliability just isnt at the level of modern cars and second 22 mpg will hurt. You need deep pockets. Beyond this they are old girls now and you can't leave them out in bad weather. Keep your Polo but sort out the Stag and once its ready (could take a while dont give up!) Enjoy as your special car.
    best of luck either way Nigel.

    Comment


      #3
      James

      I am sure you will get plenty of feedback and support should you wish to put your parents Stag back on the road, however, after 28 years standing there will be a considerable list of pre-work that should be done before it gets near the road. Some of this will depend on the car itself, how itís been stored, how often started/moved, battery/tyres state etc. etc.

      As a MINIMUM:
      Check and replace all brake and clutch seals and rubbers and replace with new fluid
      Replace all tyres - assuming they are 28 years ( or even over 10 years) old
      Fully service the engine oil, filters , plugs, points (if fitted) and if possible gearbox and rear axle oils
      Check all electrics, lights, windows, wipers etc. probably with a new battery, and all fan belts etc., then check everything works - which may be unlikely!
      The fuel is likely past its sell- by date, so fresh fuel is a must. Assuming the engine is not seized, it may still be worth putting a little oil down the plug holes before attempting to start it. Once you can get it running then;
      Other items to check would be exhaust, steering rack and joints and of course check for any structural defects/rust and this broken nut, whatever that may be.

      It sounds a daunting list, and others may recommend more work, but key is that you do as little harm as possible when starting it, and even less harm when you first take it on the road.

      Most Stag owners use them as leisure vehicles, but there are a number on here that run them as daily vehicles. They are better for regular use, will match most modern traffic, and surpass most in the looks and sound department. There have been many ďwinterĒ meeting where this Stags have had to jump start the modern vehicles, and the heaters when working are superb.

      Go for it, you know you want to.........

      Ian F

      Comment


        #4
        ah ha

        I was 21 when I bought my first stag as a daily driver,that was 1988 though.

        regarding your proposal it all depends on whether you are Lister or Spanners as to how quickly your bank account empties

        Stags and Range Rover Classics - I must be a loony

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by StagMK95 View Post
          Hi All,

          Iím from Milton Keynes and my parents have a 1976 inca yellow Stag which has been off the road in our garage for 28 years.

          Iíve been driving for nearly 3 years and iím 22 so the insurance last time I checked for my own car (Polo MK5) for a Stag was around the £700 mark and feel if I stay driving my own car its value is only dropping every year and feel like its a good time to take the opportunity into looking at having the Stag put back on the road as my next car. Iím really set on the idea of driving the Stag as my run about for many reasons, the style the sound and being something completely different to the norm, every time we would start the Stag it always put a smile on my face even though iíve never driven one.

          There are few things I would like to know about the car before i commit to the idea completely since itís quiet a jump from a modern 1.2 to a classic 3.0 V8.

          Our Stag after about 26 years last January was started up everything ran fine until the starter stopped working in September, there are few parts that would need work doing a new Driver side door, rear driver side wheel arch and thereís a bolt under the front of the car that bloke off years ago which my father mentioned would fail a MOT. The over all bodywork appears fine little rust nothing we can see to really worry over although seeing as its sat for so many years (the rear break need to break free) I would imagine many parts on the Stag would need replacing?

          Being my next car (I would have my dads mini for when weather would get really bad and while its being restored) is the Stag a car good to drive for all use, what is it like to drive is it great car to use?


          Kind Regards

          James
          If your serious about it, Join the club and get along to your local area meeting.. I would hope that some kind souls will take you under their wings and help you get it back on the road..

          If you were nearer South London I would be happy to help but unfortunately your not.
          Last edited by milothedog; 9th March 2018, 17:54.
          Wise men ignore the advice of fools, but fools ignore the advice of wise men sigpic

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by StagMK95 View Post
            Hi All,

            Iím from Milton Keynes and my parents have a 1976 inca yellow Stag which has been off the road in our garage for 28 years.

            Iíve been driving for nearly 3 years and iím 22 so the insurance last time I checked for my own car (Polo MK5) for a Stag was around the £700 mark and feel if I stay driving my own car its value is only dropping every year and feel like its a good time to take the opportunity into looking at having the Stag put back on the road as my next car. Iím really set on the idea of driving the Stag as my run about for many reasons, the style the sound and being something completely different to the norm, every time we would start the Stag it always put a smile on my face even though iíve never driven one.

            There are few things I would like to know about the car before i commit to the idea completely since itís quiet a jump from a modern 1.2 to a classic 3.0 V8.

            Our Stag after about 26 years last January was started up everything ran fine until the starter stopped working in September, there are few parts that would need work doing a new Driver side door, rear driver side wheel arch and thereís a bolt under the front of the car that bloke off years ago which my father mentioned would fail a MOT. The over all bodywork appears fine little rust nothing we can see to really worry over although seeing as its sat for so many years (the rear break need to break free) I would imagine many parts on the Stag would need replacing?

            Being my next car (I would have my dads mini for when weather would get really bad and while its being restored) is the Stag a car good to drive for all use, what is it like to drive is it great car to use?


            Kind Regards

            James
            so James a bit more info that may sway your mind in either direction.

            Being mechanically minded is a must unless you have a friendly mechanic and deep pockets.

            getting the car reliable will end up like a rolling restoration. dont expect reliability out of the box after a 28 year lay up! You need to understand that the Stag was conceived and designed in the 1960s. During that era 3000 mile or less service intervals were the norm, as was galloping rust and breaking down - a lot. My dads second car was a 1960s Ford with an engine that needed major overhauls every 30 thousand miles. his third car from the late 1960s was a rusty wreck after 6 years.

            The stag by comparison at that time must have seemed to some like those newish American cars that have 100,000 mile service intervals do to me now. like how the heck can that work out! to be honest it probably doesnt. Jags with "sealed for life" gearboxes that are dead after 70k miles. etc etc anyway I digress. I guess what I am getting at is the Stag is from an era when regular servicing is required and checks are needed weekly if not daily if in daily use. That might be an alien concept to a lot of modern cars owners who only open the bonnet to top up the screen wash.

            As far as reliability is concerned, to the mechanically minded or even mechanically sympathetic, the Stag is not a bad proposition though. There are members on here who drive daily, the club chair does iirc

            Next key point is handling, I think of a sports car as something that needs careful control of the throttle to manage a mix of under and over steer and while not particularly fast is a thrill to drive. Modern sports cars are on rails by comparison and monkeys can and do drive them. Alas the Stag is not a sports car and in its day had what was regarded as good handling, nowadays modern rubber, good poly suspension bushing and modern shock absorbers make a lot of difference I enjoy driving mine, my daily driver is a 25 year old Range Rover to the stag feels like a Lotus by comparison

            I can keep mine pointing in the right direction but if needed on a mildly moist road I can encourage it sideways and be a right hooligan. I am no track day hero nor do I drive like a tool. At the limit mine is more understeer until I lift off then it might slide depending on the road and how fast. adjustable dampers help me get it right, I would rather know when I am about to get in trouble just before I do hence understeer is good for me. So I respect it and it doesnt try to kill me. Remember that the long bonnet will crumple and compress the footwell, there are no air bags but then you shouldnt be driving if you rely on them

            Crash a mk5 Polo and you should be laughing down the pub, crash a staaag and it is going to smart a little.

            Economy, you dont say what gearbox. I have had both Auto BW35 and currently Manual O/D

            auto seemed to do 15mpg average around town and best on the motorway was about 22
            Man O/D does similar mpg around town by can easily do 26 on the motorway and I have had 30mpg out of it. I was a very steady 70mph for 200miles for that.

            Re girls standing in the rain, never bothered me more than keeping an umbrella on the back seat. These days you have Uber to get her whinging away from you

            I was the cats arse at 21 in a metalic blue stag and loved driving every mile.

            Now as I said I drive a 1993 Range Rover 3.9EFI on LPG as my daily and do all my own spannering. otherwise I probably would stick 10k / year on the staaaag
            Stags and Range Rover Classics - I must be a loony

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by StagMK95 View Post
              Hi All,

              Iím from Milton Keynes and my parents have a 1976 inca yellow Stag which has been off the road in our garage for 28 years.

              Iíve been driving for nearly 3 years and iím 22 so the insurance last time I checked for my own car (Polo MK5) for a Stag was around the £700 mark and feel if I stay driving my own car its value is only dropping every year and feel like its a good time to take the opportunity into looking at having the Stag put back on the road as my next car. Iím really set on the idea of driving the Stag as my run about for many reasons, the style the sound and being something completely different to the norm, every time we would start the Stag it always put a smile on my face even though iíve never driven one.

              There are few things I would like to know about the car before i commit to the idea completely since itís quiet a jump from a modern 1.2 to a classic 3.0 V8.

              Our Stag after about 26 years last January was started up everything ran fine until the starter stopped working in September, there are few parts that would need work doing a new Driver side door, rear driver side wheel arch and thereís a bolt under the front of the car that bloke off years ago which my father mentioned would fail a MOT. The over all bodywork appears fine little rust nothing we can see to really worry over although seeing as its sat for so many years (the rear break need to break free) I would imagine many parts on the Stag would need replacing?

              Being my next car (I would have my dads mini for when weather would get really bad and while its being restored) is the Stag a car good to drive for all use, what is it like to drive is it great car to use?


              Kind Regards

              James
              James, unless you can keep it undercover and are either mechanically minded, or have a good friend who is, it might not be a realistic prospect for year round use.

              But it you could use it through the summer and keep it up to mark by taking it out for drives on dry days every couple of weeks or so in winter.

              As to driving it, it was very sophisticated for its time, my daily drive is a 1993 E class Merc and the driving feel of the Stag is much nicer. I suspect a well sorted Stag would feel wonderful to you after the Polo.

              Iííd be happy to lend moral support as I am only in Aylesbury. I have limited mechanical knowledge, but what I have is at your disposal. But please be aware that, like all old cars, the Stag can empty your bank account and leave you broken hearted at the side of the road in a cloud of steam. Is your father willing to help out if the ownership and driving privileges are shared? A slow reveal might get him on board.

              Many years ago, when I was barely middle aged, I had a Triumph TR6 which I restored over a few years with a good friendíís help. A neighbour, who would change his cars on PCP every couple of years opined that overall we probably faced similar costs (Heííd have been paying about £220 a month out plus deposit, fuel maintenance and insurance - thatís probably more like £36o today).

              My TR never depreciated in value and I owned it outright, but I laid out the purchase price again in parts, restoration and maintenance in the first five years of ownership. But I never regretted a day or a £ of it and I still forgive the Stag every penny since I bought it four years back (and that is a LOT of pennies!). Because itís drop dead gorgeous to look at and it is a pleasure to own, drive, look at, fart about with and even smell that smell of hot oil and leather.

              But you have to be an optimist with deep pockets and a completely irrational love for something that is an anachronism. Because, whatever anyone here will tell you, compared to new cars, old cars are rubbish. They break, they rust, they drink fuel and oil and they look old. If you crash them they will hurt you badly where a modern would allow you to walk away. And thatíís part of their charm and itíís why I love them all but especially the Stag. It's a real commitment, James and some of us should probably be committed. And if you make that commitment, you will spend a lot of money and have more fun on the road than you will ever get from even a modern Ferrari.

              I guarantee it. But no one will blame you for walking away, because that is probably the sensible option. But youíre 22. You have a long time to be sensible. Good luck!

              P.S. why wonít this wretched forum recognise apostrophes? Do they have an obsessive hatred of the late Keith Waterhouse? The new version is becoming insupportable TBH!
              Last edited by TR5convalescent; 9th March 2018, 18:48.
              David

              Comment


                #8
                Hi James.

                Lot of good advice above but donít be put off by all the old farts at the monthly meetings, there are some younger ones about. .

                Sounds a great project and all credit to you bringing it back to life, they are great cars to drive.

                Second thoughts, stick with the monthly meets, there is a wealth of knowledge there and they may have 20 year old granddaughters.

                Enjoy.

                Comment


                  #9
                  James, now is probably a good point in your life to own a Stag if you don't have commitments such as a hefty mortgage & kids. If you wait too long, then these sorts of commitments will probably preclude Stag ownership until much later in life (I had to wait until I was in my 60's before I could afford one). I started learning how to fix cars about your age - it's a question of taking it in easy stages and building confidence and ability. You'll hopefully get a lot of support from your local SOC group and from this forum. It'll still cost, but you'll have an appreciating asset as well as a lot of pleasure along the way. Also, seek out small garages with good reputations, where they still have guy's who understand motors of this era. Again local SOC clubbers may be able to give you a steer here. Worth getting them to do a full structural condition assessment so you have a clear idea of what needs fixing and can quantify costs.

                  I find mine great on motorways and especially on B roads. For me, the handling is very good and it responds nicely to spirited driving, but as said, it's ~40-years old and must be respected.

                  For insurance, have you checked out specialist classic car insurance (eg RH, the Club's sponsor; Carol Nash etc (see the Club magazine))? Us old farts are generally getting it for £100 - £200 with typical annual mileage of 5,000. These policies probably won't cover commuting or business use.

                  I, and others, will be interested to hear how you get on.

                  Good luck

                  Jonno

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by KOY 23 View Post
                    Hi James.

                    Lot of good advice above but donít be put off by all the old farts at the monthly meetings, there are some younger ones about. .

                    Sounds a great project and all credit to you bringing it back to life, they are great cars to drive.

                    Second thoughts, stick with the monthly meets, there is a wealth of knowledge there and they may have 20 year old granddaughters.

                    Enjoy.
                    oi i resemble that remark and I dont even go to regional meetings
                    Stags and Range Rover Classics - I must be a loony

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Quite interesting the variety of responses that James has had - and to some extent, then we wonder why there are few younger members?

                      Dont get me wrong, I couldnít afford a Stag until I was 55+, so Iím full of admiration ( not jealous now honest) of any of these younger types that can own one. Similarly I admire each and any of you that do use your Stag as a daily driver.

                      Of course owing and and running a 40+ year old car will take more commitment, if not money, than a modern, and yes ďspecialistĒ knowledge will be harder to find. But then James could be looking to run a 45 year old Ford Escort or Morris Marina - then I could understand the reticence.

                      Perhaps we need to be more positive and share the JOY, or are we all masochists who have more money than sense and should be running a modern electric car on a contract lease?

                      Iíll get me coat and ⛑

                      p.s. And John (Koy) how many 20+ yr granddaughters come to your meetings. I may need to change area. LOL
                      Last edited by Ian F; 10th March 2018, 15:46. Reason: Afterthought

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Save your petrol Ian, itís men only.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Thankyou for all you're replies and information so far I'll start with some more information on our Stag and the daily driver usage.

                          The Stag is a auto and was a daily driver by my parents from 82 to 86 and was a daily driver by the previous owners, the Stag only really came off the road for some small issues and sadly stayed in the garage ever since. The driver side door needs changing since its rusty and easier to change for a replacement door from what my father suggested and the rear driver side wheel arch or wing would probably get replaced since the other three wings were all fitted not long before it came off the Road. Now its been sat there will be more work as mentioned in one reply the rear breaks need sorting and the exhaust has rusted however my father brought a stainless steel exhaust last year and service parts, just the possible new wing and door. There are signs of little rust here and there but nothing what appears a simple-ish repair shouldn't sort. The underneath appears good and the inside is in good condition.

                          As for becoming a daily driver the Stag wouldn't be covering many miles a day if even a week with the odd trip to places, be more a around town car around Milton Keynes. My own average mileage is around 10000 a year with around probably 3000 for trips or drives. We probably would put less mileage on the Stag since the idea is to use another car, the Stag would be a joint usage of the Stag between me and my parents. I would like to once its on the Road to try protect the car from rusting just keeping it clean and these waxes you can have put on the car as i do the same for my Polo.

                          The plan my father has in mind is to sort the breaks and service the engine get it out the garage do what would is needed to get it MOT'd since a specialist suggested that would be a good idea before then looking at respray and other work needed.

                          My father is the mechanically minded one i'm more the drive it type although i would like to have some idea so i could do some things to it as and when it needs doing.

                          Re Nigel:
                          I am thinking when it comes to selling my Polo its value is around £5000 so the value would quite easy cover lot of the restoration costs since my father would go halfs so for both of us the over all restore would be cheaper for both of us wether it would cost £10000 in total (i doubt it would be anywhere near that mark) at least going halfs would be more ease for our pockets.

                          Re Ian F:
                          When the Stag was started up the battery was changed and fresh fuel was put in, it was turned over before it was started and as it happens we have a video of the startup. I think to myself also while my Polo is worth reasonable amount of money still i think to myself is it really worth getting a new car when they to me don't appear to have that same feel to them as the Stag so i do feel in some sense to go for the Stag as the next car for me.

                          Re RichardTheStag:
                          The deep pockets does cross my mind although i think to myself if you don't have to pay tax and hopefully insurance is reasonable then it could be cheaper in one sense and more in other sense.

                          Re milothedog:
                          My parents use to be part of the owners club maybe that would be a idea!

                          Re TR5convalescen:
                          The deep pockets do worry me i must admit it feels like a great idea but then it could cost lot depends how well its restored before it goes back on the Road i suppose as if its restored right then it should get many miles out of it before it goes wrong?

                          Re Koy23:
                          Nice to hear there are some young ones about and seems these Stag meets could be interesting haha.

                          Re Jonno: Having the Stag is something i think is another point of having something to enjoy and why not enjoy something when we're young than stick to the humdrum modern car, of course lot new cars can be great but the costs can be silly for a new car if you want something nice and i'm one of those who like to use my money wisely so feel the Stag would be something i wouldn't so to speak lose out on as its value will always remain the same than a Polo's.

                          Well seems theres a interesting mix of replies always good to hear peoples thoughts! If anyone wants photos i could put some up of the Stag as since the YouTube video was taken the Stag has been cleared up lol.

                          Kind Regards

                          James
                           

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Thankyou for all you're replies and information so far I'll start with some more information on our Stag and the daily driver usage.

                            The Stag is a auto and was a daily driver by my parents from 82 to 86 and was a daily driver by the previous owners, the Stag only really came off the road for some small issues and sadly stayed in the garage ever since. The driver side door needs changing since its rusty and easier to change for a replacement door from what my father suggested and the rear driver side wheel arch or wing would probably get replaced since the other three wings were all fitted not long before it came off the Road. Now its been sat there will be more work as mentioned in one reply the rear breaks need sorting and the exhaust has rusted however my father brought a stainless steel exhaust last year and service parts, just the possible new wing and door. There are signs of little rust here and there but nothing what appears a simple-ish repair shouldn't sort. The underneath appears good and the inside is in good condition.

                            As for becoming a daily driver the Stag wouldn't be covering many miles a day if even a week with the odd trip to places, be more a around town car around Milton Keynes. My own average mileage is around 10000 a year with around probably 3000 for trips or drives. We probably would put less mileage on the Stag since the idea is to use another car, the Stag would be a joint usage of the Stag between me and my parents. I would like to once its on the Road to try protect the car from rusting just keeping it clean and these waxes you can have put on the car as i do the same for my Polo.

                            The plan my father has in mind is to sort the breaks and service the engine get it out the garage do what would is needed to get it MOT'd since a specialist suggested that would be a good idea before then looking at respray and other work needed.

                            My father is the mechanically minded one i'm more the drive it type although i would like to have some idea so i could do some things to it as and when it needs doing.

                            Re Nigel:
                            I am thinking when it comes to selling my Polo its value is around £5000 so the value would quite easy cover lot of the restoration costs since my father would go halfs so for both of us the over all restore would be cheaper for both of us wether it would cost £10000 in total (i doubt it would be anywhere near that mark) at least going halfs would be more ease for our pockets.

                            Re Ian F:
                            When the Stag was started up the battery was changed and fresh fuel was put in, it was turned over before it was started and as it happens we have a video of the startup. I think to myself also while my Polo is worth reasonable amount of money still i think to myself is it really worth getting a new car when they to me don't appear to have that same feel to them as the Stag so i do feel in some sense to go for the Stag as the next car for me.

                            Re RichardTheStag:
                            The deep pockets does cross my mind although i think to myself if you don't have to pay tax and hopefully insurance is reasonable then it could be cheaper in one sense and more in other sense.

                            Re milothedog:
                            My parents use to be part of the owners club maybe that would be a idea!

                            Re TR5convalescen:
                            The deep pockets do worry me i must admit it feels like a great idea but then it could cost lot depends how well its restored before it goes back on the Road i suppose as if its restored right then it should get many miles out of it before it goes wrong?

                            Re Koy23:
                            Nice to hear there are some young ones about and seems these Stag meets could be interesting haha.

                            Re Jonno: Having the Stag is something i think is another point of having something to enjoy and why not enjoy something when we're young than stick to the humdrum modern car, of course lot new cars can be great but the costs can be silly for a new car if you want something nice and i'm one of those who like to use my money wisely so feel the Stag would be something i wouldn't so to speak lose out on as its value will always remain the same than a Polo's.

                            Well seems theres a interesting mix of replies always good to hear peoples thoughts!

                            Kind Regards

                            James

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by TR5convalescent View Post

                              James, unless you can keep it undercover and are either mechanically minded, or have a good friend who is, it might not be a realistic prospect for year round use.

                              But it you could use it through the summer and keep it up to mark by taking it out for drives on dry days every couple of weeks or so in winter.

                              As to driving it, it was very sophisticated for its time, my daily drive is a 1993 E class Merc and the driving feel of the Stag is much nicer. I suspect a well sorted Stag would feel wonderful to you after the Polo.

                              Iííd be happy to lend moral support as I am only in Aylesbury. I have limited mechanical knowledge, but what I have is at your disposal. But please be aware that, like all old cars, the Stag can empty your bank account and leave you broken hearted at the side of the road in a cloud of steam. Is your father willing to help out if the ownership and driving privileges are shared? A slow reveal might get him on board.

                              Many years ago, when I was barely middle aged, I had a Triumph TR6 which I restored over a few years with a good friendíís help. A neighbour, who would change his cars on PCP every couple of years opined that overall we probably faced similar costs (Heííd have been paying about £220 a month out plus deposit, fuel maintenance and insurance - thatís probably more like £36o today).

                              My TR never depreciated in value and I owned it outright, but I laid out the purchase price again in parts, restoration and maintenance in the first five years of ownership. But I never regretted a day or a £ of it and I still forgive the Stag every penny since I bought it four years back (and that is a LOT of pennies!). Because itís drop dead gorgeous to look at and it is a pleasure to own, drive, look at, fart about with and even smell that smell of hot oil and leather.

                              But you have to be an optimist with deep pockets and a completely irrational love for something that is an anachronism. Because, whatever anyone here will tell you, compared to new cars, old cars are rubbish. They break, they rust, they drink fuel and oil and they look old. If you crash them they will hurt you badly where a modern would allow you to walk away. And thatíís part of their charm and itíís why I love them all but especially the Stag. It's a real commitment, James and some of us should probably be committed. And if you make that commitment, you will spend a lot of money and have more fun on the road than you will ever get from even a modern Ferrari.

                              I guarantee it. But no one will blame you for walking away, because that is probably the sensible option. But youíre 22. You have a long time to be sensible. Good luck!

                              P.S. why wonít this wretched forum recognise apostrophes? Do they have an obsessive hatred of the late Keith Waterhouse? The new version is becoming insupportable TBH!
                              Good to hear your in Aylesbury. Maybe worth meeting up?

                              James

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X