Won't start not even a solenoid click

[Andyman]

Guys, could do with some help.
Turn the key and I get nothing from the engine. The lights, fan, radio and everything works but the engine won't turn over and the starter solenoid doesn't click.
the battery is a about a year old and has a good charge and lights don't dim when I try to start, suggesting it is good.

From memory there here is very little wiring involved here, so can only really be a bad earth, ignition switch or the starter solenoid.
Earth looks good with a ohms test between battery and engine. So that just leave ignition switch and/or starter solenoid.
or am I missing something else.
cheers.
all and any thoughts appreciated.
Andy

[DJT]

Manual or auto?

[richardthestag]

easy and simple circuit.

there is a red/white wire that runs from the ignition switch to the solenoid. you need to check it has 12v

You can test the solenoid is working with a short length of wire to connect the big black wire on the back of the starter to the terminal that has the red/white wire.

Make sure it is out of gear first though...

I the solenoid is good I think there is only one connector and that is above the steering column where a multiconnector seperates the loom for the starter switch. again from the loom side - not the ignition side bridge from brown wire to red/white and the starter should engage.

[richardthestag]

edited to add, good point DJT

there is another connector, the gear box loom. Manual the red/white loops around through the gearbox loom connector which is just above the starter motor.

auto the red white wire goes down to the gearbox inhibitor that stops you starting it in gear

[Andyman]

Thanks guys, car is manuals/drive. I'll look to check out the wiring as discribed and look to bridge across.
Just wish I had not parked the car into a tight space and now can't get around the front, so I need to pull it by hand.
cheers guys,
Andy

[richardthestag]

I pull mine by hand every time I need to.....

get it out of the garage.

with handbrake off they are not heavy

[Phil S]

Had similar on mine, turned out to be the red/white wire was not soldered into the back of the ignition switch, only crimped and had come out
re soldered all OK now.
Phil

[Andyman]

So I have power on the red/white wire coming out of the ignition switch when it's turned - there is probably a 1 V drop from 12V going in at brown to 11V coming out. I don't know if that is significant but I would think that is enough to trigger the starter solenoid.
I can hear the fuel pump working but I only have power on one side on the inhibitor switch (on bulkhead) which I thought feed the fuel pump.

I know I need to get underneath and check every think out under there just run out of time before my holiday.
Happy to have insults and ideas
cheers, Andy

[Andyman]

So a quick review. Manual, o/drive. Turn the key and I get nothing from the engine. The lights, fan, radio and everything works but the engine won't turn over and the starter solenoid doesn't click.
the battery is a about a year old and has a good charge and lights don't dim when I try to start, suggesting it is good.

So checked power at the red/white wire at the solenoid and I only have 9.6 volts - there is a 1 volt drop across the ignition switch. The rest of the drop must be in the loom.
There is 12.4V on the big brown connection

Surely even 9.6V would fire the starter solenoid???
However, I used jump leads to introduce 12V to the starter and nothing - not even a click.

Just to check; this is a dead starter motor ? - just never had one fail in one hit. They normally play silly buggers and then get more and more fussy.

am I missing something else. All and any thoughts appreciated.
Andy

[StagJonno]

Assume the 1V drop at the Ignition switch is on the White/ Red wire (white being the base colour, red being the stripe).. Anyway, the drop to 9.6V to the solenoid demonstrates that current is flowing.

It looks like the pull-in winding circuit inside the solenoid is knackered. The solenoid has 2 x windings - one to pull the solenoid in (heavy current) which is only energised until the solenoid has moved to starter-oerating position, and a second "maintain" winding (lighter current) which holds it in until the key start is released.. The "maintain" winding isn't man enough to pull the solenoid in on its own.

It's too many years since I last stripped a solenoid and I'm afraid I can't remember the detail of the switching arrangement for the pull-in coil. The ROM or Haynes might have some detail, though mine isn't currently to hand. Some on here have worked on the solenoid and refaced the internal main contactor and may be able to advise.

Jonno

[thebadleys]

Assume the 1V drop at the Ignition switch is on the White/ Red wire (white being the base colour, red being the stripe).. Anyway, the drop to 9.6V to the solenoid demonstrates that current is flowing.

It looks like the pull-in winding circuit inside the solenoid is knackered. The solenoid has 2 x windings - one to pull the solenoid in (heavy current) which is only energised until the solenoid has moved to starter-oerating position, and a second "maintain" winding (lighter current) which holds it in until the key start is released.. The "maintain" winding isn't man enough to pull the solenoid in on its own.

It's too many years since I last stripped a solenoid and I'm afraid I can't remember the detail of the switching arrangement for the pull-in coil. The ROM or Haynes might have some detail, though mine isn't currently to hand. Some on here have worked on the solenoid and refaced the internal main contactor and may be able to advise.

Jonno

This may be what Jonno is referring https://socforum.com/forum/forum/sta...er-motor-click

Nigel

[Andyman]

Guys,
Thanks for all your help but I thought I'd let you know how it was all sorted.
Starter would not spin with power direct to the solenoid and showing 12v at the main feed, so I removed it. Long 3/8 socket from the front did the trick for the top bolt and bottom one dead easy, come out past the exhaust pipe easy enough, just only in one direction and angle.
Tried it again on the floor with jump leads and it fired on about the third time quite happily but nothing the first two goes. So I clean ended it and brass wire brushed all the terminals and cleaned up the wire feeds, which were very dirty - checked after and the 9V was now showing 12V at the red/white wire.
Bolted it back in connected it up and it fired up a treat and no issues what so ever.
moral - clean all electrical connections before anything else.
Once again, cheers guys.