T35 tailshaft

[tvrgeek]

This cant be right!. Replaced the end seal on the tail shaft. I noticed the shaft was "floppy" as in not well supported. Wiggles around. Looking at the manual, I don't see any bearing to the back end. Is this correct? No way will it seal with the drive shaft pulling down on it a little.

[Lingen]

There is a bush in there behind the oil seal which can be replaced, or at least it used to be available many years ago. It is not a clever arrangement, and is presumably why it was then done properly on the 65
with a bearing, and a flange connection to the propshaft..
Mike.

[tvrgeek]

Interesting. The seals I got from Rimmer were not as deep as the one I pulled out, so there would be room for a bush. I will investigate further.

[tvrgeek]

Chatted with Rimmer. Gave me a number that their search did not see. Then said "nothing in their catalog" and he hung up on me. There is no way this could be correct. Was it bronze?

[alan_thomas]

Just PM'd you an email address for a guy called Andy Morgan, he rebuilds these boxes and many other types and seems to have a cache of spares. he can certainly tell you what supports the tailshaft on the BW35 box. very impressed with his knowledge and the service he gives - Alan
PS he may take a couple of days to respond but it is worth the wait

[tvrgeek]

I have gotten two other responses that say it should, but no source yet. I'll be contacting the gentleman Alan suggested as well as wittrans.com and one company says to sent the dimensions and they wil research. Going to pull it out again and look carefully for wear pattern on the yoke. I don't remember seeing it, just the pitting from really bad casting inclusions that fortunately, a speedi-sleeve covered.

One of many mysteries I expect.

[Alacrity]

Auto gearboxes are my living, so I have seen (& continue to see) a lot of BW35/65's & this is normal. The rear of the output shaft is supported by a bush in the end of the tailhousing that runs on the propshaft. So once the propshaft it fitted it is then supported both ends, a common arrangement on autos to this day. What the BW35/65 does suffer with badly is bush wear throughout the transmission, so if the output bush is worn (or the nose of the propshaft where the bush runs) you will struggle to stop it leaking. Bushes are getting more difficult to get hold of but we can usually get what we need still. You can call me on 01323 846666 if you want advice any time.

[Phil S]

if it a bronze Bush why not get one turned up?

[tvrgeek]

After I figure out why my MGB Battery suddenly died, I will pull the seal out and get a camera in there to see if there is actually a bush. I did not see one when I looked by eyeball. Making sense. I was not planning on pulling the trans, but it starting to look that way.

As I have never seen the bush, no idea if it is bronze or other material. That is a possibility.

[Lingen]

See Alacrity's response on the 27th who says he may still be able to get one. If I remember correctly, it is a thin walled steel bush that is split lengthways and a push fit in to the rear extension casting.
I fitted one, but it didn't get rid of all the free play. I suspect there was probably wear on the propshaft as well, on the outside, and internally on the spline.
Mike.

[Alacrity]

Lingen is correct, it is a split steel walled white metal bush that presses in. I have been in contact with the OP by PM a couple of times.

[tvrgeek]

Got enough light up in there. Sure enough. It looks really worn. I can't imagine how I could cange it in place, so guess I pull the whole thing out. I also guess I have the wrong seals as they are only .3 inches deep and the pocket is twice that. Prop shaft only measures to spec. I finally understand what I am dealing with. I'll be looking to try and order these parts. As I am pulling the darn trans, maybe I should look at opening it up too and doing a refresh. The book shows a few special tools, some I can make. Kick sown adjustment seems to be the hairiest.

[Alacrity]

All looks normal to me, but as I said in my PM you won't take advice from someone who specialises in nothing but auto 'boxes (since 1979) so I am giving up advising on this thread. Quite why you would pull the trans for a rear end leak is beyond me, but hey ho, you know best.

[tvrgeek]

It did not look normal and I see no way to replace the bushing without removing the housing from the transmission. It does not look like there is room to remove just the extension, but that woudl be my next question. I have only dealt with a C4 and did not have any slop.

You said in the PM that the amount of play I have might be normal, so I'll put it together and see how much it leaks. As I said in the PM, I might then try adding a couple more speedie-sleeves out where it runs in the sleeve to reduce the play. I just have never seen anything this sloppy before. If it had not been leaking, I would not be looking at it. You wonder about my questions on the seal, but again, I have never seen a seal that did not have a lip in the back to rest on and the seals I bought were much thinner than the one I pulled out. I am not challenging or ignoring the advice. I am trying to understand it.

[tvrgeek]

I did get confirmation from an additional source the seal depth is in fact because of availability. It was designed for a .6 seal, but they only have the .303 now. SOP is to try and fit flush with the end. Relying on the casting to be square. I think this is very poor practice so will look into how to make a thin lip spacer to ensure it seating square with the shaft and not block the fluid return port. A critical feature identified in PM.

I also got conformation the bushing clearance should be closer to .005, not probably close to .065, so I'll be pulling the extension housing so I can get to the bushing. I hope I can get it clear without having to pull the whole trans. Maybe I can pull the bush out with it just slid back so the shaft is out of the way. So far, the factory manual has had a lot of this wrong!