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    #16
    imported post

    The tooling fund is a unique Stag club endeavour. I think the problem idea of recreating head casting is a laudable and monumentalenterprise but I fear it may be as doomed as the re-manufactured of original wiper blades. If you remember the tooling fund funded the tooling to re-manufacture the original blades but after a very small run the company manufacturing them failed and now there seems little prospect of re-manufacture. The problem with theheads are they are so costly that it seems unlikely that anyone would fund the casting and machiningof say 30 of each side and if they produced lots of say5 then the casting and machining cost would be disproportionally high. The high cost puts people off buying thus making the production run even shorter and the unit cost higher. Its a 'demand, price spiral'
    I am not unhappy that Abingdon Hammer have a monopoly inmanufacture as presumably they would supply to other outlets in the same way other re-manufactured parts are distributed. However I hope the SOCTF has an agreement in place that makes the tooling their property so that in the, hopefully unlikely, event that AH go bust or 'cool on the idea' the investment is not lost. I am not criticising the SOCTF as they have commissioned projects like the wings and rain channels that have given us excellentquality items.


    Personally I don't think our yearly subscription is too high and the use of these grants by the SOCTF may not always bear fruit but it is a better use of funds than giving every member a keyring and reducing the next years subscription as was the case a few years back when the club found itself cash rich.

    Well Done to everyone involved, we may never be able to afford them but to recreate them was a real achievement. - Alan

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      #17
      imported post

      just to clarify , i do not think any firm should do something for nothing, but i think if the club has put money into something then as we have experienced before, things can go wrong and the money was lost.

      as far as i am aware AHM is not a foundry andhave not heard anything about them for at least 5 years, then out the blue they are the sole supplier of a product funded by the club, which there is stillconfusion about the price 2k a pair? 2k each? does anyone know yet?

      as someone said they are not unhappy about the monopoly siuation, I am.

      this is something to important to let a single small company handle, unless someone from soc tooling fund can reassure me.

      rgds nick

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        #18
        imported post

        Hi Nick,

        Long time no speak. I don't see how you could have more than one manufacturer of this product, it is technically complex and low volume, so probably increasing the costgreatly if you reduce the volume still further. This isa project a big company is not going to be interested in and anyway they can go bust just as easily as a small company. I'm sure SOC are acting in best interest and let's face it we are going to run out of heads sooner or lateras quite a few it would appear have already been skimmed to the limit, so they are future proofing the engine. It is debatable, of course, if other projects were more urgent/worthwile etc. but let's not forget people have given up their free time to devote to this project and for that they should be applauded. Heads now, blocks later, decent pistons after that and eventually we will be able to build completely new engines (albeit at huge cost!)

        I don't think SOC members should get a discount but non members should be charged more, (same but different I know).

        Happy cycling!

        Dave

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          #19
          imported post

          Hi Dave

          may be i went round the houses, i just think it is best that a product is available from different suppliers, as a wholesale item, not that there should be more than one maker.

          are we any where nearer to knowing a price?

          rgds Nick

          ps trying to keep the pedals turning...you?

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            #20
            imported post

            I do not in any way have a problem with one manufacture of the product as there isn't!

            The castings are done by one company, the milling, drilling and tapping are done by a company in Gloucester, the Valve seats, guides and cam bores are done by another company in the south.

            AHM sell them, and I would presume will also fit them at an additional charge.

            What I want to know is what warranty is given on the heads and are there any small print issue's such as who fitted them?

            The price as far as Roger and Mike indicated was approx £2k per pair.

            SOCTFL own the patterns which AHM have exclusive use of and have also placed a loan of £5k so AHM will stock the heads with the view that 100 pairs will be sold in 5 years.

            It is fantastic that the heads have been done and the people concerned had dedicated so much time and effort in getting the job done. It is easy for me and anyone else to comment in hindsight the detail but after all is said and done we have new heads to fit if we need them.

            Now let's have the block, jackshaft and water pump.

            Stuart


            Comment


              #21
              imported post

              stustag wrote:
              I do not in any way have a problem with one manufacture of the product as there isn't!

              The castings are done by one company, the milling, drilling and tapping are done by a company in Gloucester, the Valve seats, guides and cam bores are done by another company in the south.

              AHM sell them, and I would presume will also fit them at an additional charge.

              What I want to know is what warranty is given on the heads and are there any small print issue's such as who fitted them?

              The price as far as Roger and Mike indicated was approx £2k per pair.

              SOCTFL own the patterns which AHM have exclusive use of and have also placed a loan of £5k so AHM will stock the heads with the view that 100 pairs will be sold in 5 years.

              It is fantastic that the heads have been done and the people concerned had dedicated so much time and effort in getting the job done. It is easy for me and anyone else to comment in hindsight the detail but after all is said and done we have new heads to fit if we need them.

              Now let's have the block, jackshaft and water pump.

              Stuart

              thanks for that Stu, particuarly the price, which i think is fair particuarly if its a valuable car. i am with you on the warranty side.

              rgds Nick

              Comment


                #22
                imported post

                mad cyclist wrote:

                ps trying to keep the pedals turning...you?
                Doing a bit, and a few time trials, not very quick though! Doing Oxford to Cambridge later in the year for BHF, should be ok.

                If the heads are 2k a pair I would say that's not a bad price for brand new, considering the volume etc.

                Dave

                Comment

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